So... an NMA track you REALLY don't like..?

[8]

Greetings Stephanie,

I don't think I can help you to understand...but the thing is – I feel I don't have a right to even try.

Hey, I'll take help in understanding the lyric / line from anyone, because that suicide line in the song has been dogging me ever since I first heard it, all those years ago.   

I have even had it happen that one and the same song meant something else for me when I was young than it does now.  And that is ok.

OMG!  I thought it was just me that this happened to.  Every single one of NMA/JS songs has a whole new other light / side / meaning to me, ever since 2005, especially.  It's like there already was a lit light bulb on - in my mind, my mind's eye - but then some strange thing happened... out of nowhere, someone came into my life and made a small adjustment to that tiny lightbulb, where the light was glowing - in a normal fashion - and somehow made that tiny lightbulb produce a light far beyond and greater than its full capacity.  Now that light is SO vivid, it lights up, reaches, and kisses everything in its path.  I can't explain it any better than that, but it was something I was definitely not expecting to happen, neither was I ready for it, at the time.  It still amazes me, leaves me stunned that that was even fathomable, possible.  It was like magic... for lack of a better term.  Stunning, enlightening, exhilarating, beautiful, comforting.

As far as this specific song is concerned, I have always interpreted it as some young, probably very insecure person being obsessively in love with someone (as you often are when you are still young) - and getting all worked up by their feelings not being requited (is that the correct term to use in this context?).  So this person is being all dramatic, imagining what they would do to get the object of their desire to finally notice them.  Dunno, I think we have all been there to a degree, haven't we?

Wow.  It never even dawned / donned on me that the boy / young man in the song was trying to reach out to the object of his desires... a love.  lol, now I'm even more fcuked up because of these other two preceding lines in the song...

"I'll make a lot of money and tread on you if you'll only notice me
I'll tell you any lies you want to hear – for God's sake notice me
Or I'll kill myself while you are watching"

   

Hmmm,  "Notice Me"  is becoming even darker than I'd originally taken or thought it to be.   

BUT, depending on how insecure someone is, and depending on whether or not there are more mature, grounded people in that person's life, it is easy to see how such feelings/ways of thinking can get out of hand and indeed become more serious.

I completely believe this, as well.   

Until I had read your posts it has never occurred to me to consider that the song might be about someone who has already gone a step further – into morbid obsession, or indeed even depression – but I see how, depending on maybe personal experiences, this is a very possible way of looking at it.  And yes, I can also see how this can make you feel very sad and uncomfortable.  I don't feel that way about this song – but if you do this is perfectly legitimate, why ever wouldn't it be?  And if our dear Whirlwind interprets the song in yet another way – excellent.

Thank you Stephanie. 

I don't recall reading about Justin Sullivan saying anything about this song, sorry.

Maybe it's time someone asked Mr. Sullivan, then.  embarrassed soft lol, I'll just have to add it to my ongoing list, for when the next official NMA  Q & A opportunity surfaces.     Hopefully it will be on this site / forum, as I am not on facefook or fritter, nor will I ever be.  still embarrassed soft lol, I have way too many questions     and I haven't even seen  Matt Reid's  "Between Dog and Wolf"  NMA documentary yet!

The way I see it, what makes lyrics really good is that they speak to different people in different ways.  We are all different, have had different experiences in our respective lives.  Regardless of what the writer of any given song might have had in mind when writing it (well, sometimes it's plain obvious, but not always), for one reason or another they might mean something completely different to me. And then something else entirely for someone else.  And none of that is wrong or bad. It's what makes lyrics great, the fact that they touch people, reach them, ring true for them...  ...I think it's perfectly fine to interpret songs in your own way...and it can be really interesting to talk about the different ways in which people understand lyrics.

I absolutely love these kinds of talks.  I find them terribly fascinating.  Thank you ever so much for your participation, help and taking the time to post, Stephanie.  It has been a true pleasure. 

And, before you get your knickers / pants / undies  in a twist there, Whirlwind... same goes for you too, thank you. 

Notice  Me
(Sullivan/Morrow)
1983

"I'll take any drug in the whole damn world if you'll only notice me
Mainline poisons by the score – please will you notice me
I'll break any law, hurt anybody – for God's sake notice me
Cut my wrists and slash my face for Christ's sake notice me
I'll drink anybody into the ground if you'll only notice me
I'll kick the teeth out of anyone here – come on and notice me
I'll wear the clothes and cut my hair – please will you notice me
I'll be a pop star and I'll stand on stage – for God's sake notice me

Chorus:
Who told him that it mattered?
Who told him that anyone cared?
He's got an overgrown sense of his own importance
No one's really bothered around here
He was such a quiet boy, never any trouble before . . .

I'll get a big car and drive like a maniac – please notice me
I'll make a lot of money and tread on you if you'll only notice me
I'll tell you any lies you want to hear – for God's sake notice me
Or I'll kill myself while you are watching"

[Stephanie]

You are most welcome, 8 - thank YOU for bringing this up...I like it when someone makes me think about things I have sort of taken for granted. I mean, your question made me look at that song again and try to look at it from different perspectives.

There is that point about the young man/person in the song being obsessed with someone - that was my interpretation - but...come to think of it...could also be someone who feels invisible, is...I don't know...very normal, bit of a "grey mouse" and feels that nobody really cares about him, feels that they have no idea he even exists - and then has all these "daydreams" about how doing certain things would finally get people's attention - and he is so starved for it that he would literally consider anything just to get that attention.
Or it's a certain circle of people he wants to belong to and whose attention he wants.

And again the question is...is he just playing out all these scenarios in his mind and would never really do any of it? Or is he close to the point where he is going to actually start doing stuff, some of it indeed very dark?

Both approaches make me sad - because even if it's all just in his mind it may mean he will just continue to be invisible....and possibly totally miss the fact that there ARE people who care and who he doesn't have to impress with crazy actions.

For good order's sake: I keep writing "he" - that person could obviously also be a "she". 

[Whirlwind]

...there can never really be a right or wrong with these things, that's the beauty of really good art.

.
That is so not true.

You are suggesting that an artist has no specific goal. Have you ever written a song? Let me educate you: people write a song because they want to express something. "Christian Militia" is not about a football team. If you think it is about a football team, you'd be wrong. You can't fall back on, "That's what it means to me." Mr. Sullivan wrote it about a specific thing. Songwriters wish to express a specific thought/feeling and if you say, "No, it is about whatever it means to me," then that is showing great disrespect to the songwriter. You are essentially telling the artist I don't believe what you are saying.

Art is specific. If you think it is something the artist did not intend, then you have a problem understanding art. "Christian Militia" is not about a soccer team even if you say it is. "Notice Me" is not about suicide even if a listener says it is.

[Tony S]

To add to all the other comments on the subject of Notice Me, I would add that the song actually ends with a repeat of the chorus. In the chorus, someone, or people in general are referring to the boy/young man, and saying;

"He was such a quiet boy, he was never any trouble before"

with the emphasis there on "was". This suggests that he has actually done something stupid, maybe carried out one of his threats/fantasies to try and get the object of his obsession to notice him. However, the chorus also contains the line;

"He's got an overblown sense of his own importance"

which is in the present tense, rather than "He had an overblown sense...". So this suggests that whatever he had done, it wasn't the last item on his list thankfully.

[Whirlwind]

.
"He's got an overblown sense of his own importance"

.
The line that follows that line was always of interest to me. The lyrics have the next line as:

"No one's really bothered around here"

Yet, when I first listened to that song (no lyrics sheet) I always heard:

"He's got an overblown sense of his own importance,
No one's really bought it 'round here."

Which is essentially the same thing...the dopey kid is dimissed. All his wild talk is just for show. No one's bought it, no one's bothered by it. Which makes 8's assessment of the "kill myself" line even more wrong. Everybody in town knows the guy is a bullshitter. Big talk, no action as we say in the States.

[Stephanie]

To add to all the other comments on the subject of Notice Me, I would add that the song actually ends with a repeat of the chorus. In the chorus, someone, or people in general are referring to the boy/young man, and saying;

"He was such a quiet boy, he was never any trouble before"

with the emphasis there on "was". This suggests that he has actually done something stupid, maybe carried out one of his threats/fantasies to try and get the object of his obsession to notice him. However, the chorus also contains the line;

"He's got an overblown sense of his own importance"

which is in the present tense, rather than "He had an overblown sense...". So this suggests that whatever he had done, it wasn't the last item on his list thankfully.

Oh, right...I had never given the tenses much thought, to be honest...but that IS an important point.

[cthulhu]

to me there's no single person described in this song.
it's the use of the first person view for dramatic reasons and for expression. the song uses that pov as a technique to describe roots of human, adolescent behaviour with no particular person in the meaning.  a character used to describe those manners which occur, if someone feels under-noticed or has some problems with his ego, testosterone maybe also.
so i think that it is a collection of topics and behaviours with the same root, but not a single history.

the outside world is reacting and doesn't know why the character is acting like that, and they wonder because they only saw a quiet boy in the past. to me that's a well used cliche here, it's what most people will say when they have only surfacial relationships with others.
it shows the disconnection to society or its rules of behaviour from the other side. we all have to maintain our masks and if we do most people are satisfied.

[Whirlwind]

Well said, cthulhu.

[ldopas]

8, as I said at the start, you are misunderstanding that lyric.

But, hey, you can interpret any song the way you want. If you want to think "Smalltown England" is about London, have at it.

You tell them they are misunderstanding the song, then go on to say "you can interpret any song the way you want". Contradiction.

[Whirlwind]

8, as I said at the start, you are misunderstanding that lyric.

But, hey, you can interpret any song the way you want. If you want to think "Smalltown England" is about London, have at it.

You tell them they are misunderstanding the song, then go on to say "you can interpret any song the way you want". Contradiction.

.
Are you serious?

I say "hey, you can interpret any song the way you want" and then point out the stupidity in doing that: thinking "Smalltown England" is about London.

Read my above post where I point out people interpreting songs in their own way is both idiotic and disrespectful to the artist who wrote the song. I guess I have to make it clear to you: interpreting a song in your own way is dumb. It is not the way the artist intended the song. If you want to think "Smalltown England" is about Manchester that would be dumb.

[Stephanie]

Read my above post where I point out people interpreting songs in their own way is both idiotic and disrespectful to the artist who wrote the song. I guess I have to make it clear to you: interpreting a song in your own way is dumb. It is not the way the artist intended the song. If you want to think "Smalltown England" is about Manchester that would be dumb.

Nope my dear...telling people what to think and how to interpret things...like songs...that is dumb - and rude. But hey, we all know who this is coming from so it does not come as a suprise.

The only one being disrespectful here - and to artists as well - that is you.

BUT...you are clearly enjoying that - so I'll leave you to it. Sad enough that this seems to be one of the few things that gives you joy. 

[Tony S]

And I've been posting on this board and earlier iterations of it for 15 years plus.

I reckon it must be getting on for 20 years now ldopas. I remember you and I (I think !) trying to convince everyone else how good the first 6 Van Halen albums were ! Going waaaay back 

[Red]

...
I have always interpreted it as some young, probably very insecure person....this person is being all dramatic, imagining what they would do to get the object of their desire to finally notice them.
Dunno, I think we have all been there to a degree, haven't we? 

Until I had read your posts it has never ocurred to me to consider that the song might be about someone who has already gone a step further - into morbid obsession, or indeed even depression -

Bingo.

8, as I said at the start, you are misunderstanding that lyric.

But, hey, you can interpret any song the way you want. If you want to think "Smalltown England" is about London, have at it.

In my eyes Smalltown England relates to where I grew up and my personal experiences and its not London or Bradford

We could all relate to all or part of this track depending how we interpret it

[chunky]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSvGPRZm3qo

[8]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSvGPRZm3qo

Oooo, Chunky... you don't like "Inheritance"!

Mr. Sullivan's vocal is the best thing about it.  He's not really singing, but moreso speaking in his beautifully rich, natural tone.  "Inheritance"  would work a cappella,  actually.  Never quite understood what the lyric  "We line up at THE wedding, in rows of deep set eyes"  fully or actually meant, alluded to.  Like, whose wedding was it anyway?  Was is some arranged marriage or something?  Perhaps that's what brought on the  "rows of deep set eyes"?  hopeless lol, like we're ever going to know, have these questions answered.  Still, part of the joy of listening to the contents of the NMA/JS repertoire is the sacred room it affords for each of us to wonder, think, ask, grow, dream.  Qualities of which I value, cherish, love.