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General Category => New Model Army => Topic started by: peternotbaldyet on February 06, 2015, 09:55:04 PM
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There's another thread at the moment about Eight and some of the comments reminded me about The Love of Hopeless Causes. I was so looking forward to that album after the previous two, but when I heard it, it left me cold and it took years and years to really appreciate it. It seemed to have lost the subtlety of the previous albums. I know BDAW sharply divided fans. Did anyone else get that with LHOC or was it just me?
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There's another thread at the moment about Eight and some of the comments reminded me about The Love of Hopeless Causes. I was so looking forward to that album after the previous two, but when I heard it, it left me cold and it took years and years to really appreciate it. It seemed to have lost the subtlety of the previous albums. I know BDAW sharply divided fans. Did anyone else get that with LHOC or was it just me?
Yes and yes again. TLOHC disappointed me at first, mainly because of my insane love for Impurity... I've grown to love it more over the years, but it still isn't one of my faves... even though Fate and Bad Old World are two of my favourites... the b-sides released over that period are IMO better than what was on the album.
But it seems to be a favourite amongst many fans... what do we know? ;)
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When it was released I immediately found the first 4-5 songs to be powerful ones. I think the time then in the world could be heard from the album. It was a big change with generations and worldwide period of depression. I enjoy the album but have to admit its sound was a bit "sad" in it.
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I totally agree, although I think my taste in music was changing to at this point. I kinda wish they'd stuck with the violins for 1 more album. I seem to remember Justin saying how it was a conscious decision to drop them at this point because they didn't want to get boxed in as a certain type of band. Probably a wise decision in the long run but I feel like they might have become very big at this point and maybe even followed The Levellers into the charts.
As I say this might not have helped their independence and longevity but I would've liked more Celtic tinged rock at the time (and even now!). I do like this album now - Bad old world is a fave! But along with Strange Brotherhood remains 1 of my 2 least listened to albums.
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I'm on the other side of the fence I've always loved lohc and it will always be one of my favourite lps. Maybe i could just relate to it more, when it came out my life was in a bad place and the songs just spoke to me. Never been a big fan of here comes the war though.
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Lohc instantly resonated with me more than other nma albums, the back to basics rock approach and the melancholy throughout, i felt at the time it was their reaction to the nirvana revolution in music but looking back it was probably just them wanting to do something different, either way it was possibly their most defining change in direction, never felt here comes the war fitted the over all sound though superb song as it is.
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Peter, felt exactly the same with LOHC. Was not the follow up to the last two albums I hoped it would be. Have always regarded it as my least favourite NMA album. I think that feeling has stayed with me but that said, I can listen to the album from start to finish and enjoy it. I suppose as a fan of the band, least favourite is still good.
For me things were back on track with "Strange Brotherhood".
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Yes, Shush, love SB as I've mentioned before... still surprised about how Justin doesn't seem to rate it very highly...
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But there are also very noticeable and interesting details with LOHC too. The Afternoon Song which was mixed by Riku Mattila; These Things which is one of the best of acoustic songs by NMA; and at least Bad Old World. I also think that My People should be noticed longside other similar type of songs such as Stormclouds, My Country and the Charge.
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I do remember feeling a bit under-whelmed when I first got LOHC. I think it seemed a bit disjointed and just didn't “hang together” as an album.
But as it turns out 22 years after it's release it's got 6 songs on it I still listen to a fair bit so it couldn't have been that bad could it :)
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First impression:
Last breath of a dying band.
I came to "Hopeless Causes" a bit differently than everybody. After "Thunder and Consolation" (because of the beginning of "Green and Grey" sounding like Yes' "Roundabout") I was completely put off by NMA and didn't buy an NMA record for six years. How could this muscular, hard rocking band give us so much acoustic crap and even steal from the worst band on Earth, Yes? I was gutted. What the hell happened to savage tunes like "Vengeance," "Frightened," "Western Dream," "Master Race"? Now they give us bad versions of the intro to Yes's "Roundabout." I stopped buying NMA records and went full tilt into the Seattle sound. There was hard rocking. There was savage guitar sounds. NMA were a great band that had its day. Over. Finished. Done.
Then one Christmas six years later I saw they had a new album called "Hopeless Causes" out. I just put it on my list (I wasn't going to buy it) and Santa delivered it. When I opened it, sadness set in. Just ten songs. No pictures of the band (they must be balding, fat old farts). Even the album title conveyed that the band itself was nothing now but a hopeless cause. Just a sad release. Nothing special at all. Sad. This once mighty band is now releasing an album of just ten songs, poorly packaged, not even brave enough to put their faces to the work. Sad.
Then I played it.
YESSSSSSS! "Here Comes The War" is not only one of the mightiest NMA songs ever, it is one of the greatest ass-kiccking rock songs in history. "Young money men play paintball games!" The rest of the album could be the boys covering Partridge Family tunes, but with that one lyric and the way Justin sings it the album would be worth every cent. Oh, man, that line and the way he sings it is better than anything Elvis, Lennon, Dylan, Shakespeare, Michelangelo ever did. "Young money men play paintball gamessssss! Here comes the WAAAAAAR!" Go back and listen to it again. Understand why NMA are millions of miles above everyone else (except The Beatles and Prince).
And the rest of the album isn't just Partridge Family covers. I listened to it, and, yeah, nothing matches the savage power of "Here comes the WAAAAAAR!," but there are some interesting as hell, top songs on the lp."Living In The Rose," "Afternoon Song," and the non-sleep inducing acoustic tune "These Words" are the standout tracks. The other tracks are mostly weak, so we get four out of ten songs that are good. Not a good ratio, but as I said "Yound money men play paintball games" makes the album worth every penny.
So after six years away I got to re-visit my old friends. Were they as young and vital as I last remember them? No. But the initial sadness upon putting my hands on "LOHC" turned to excitement and I went out and bought the two lps I skipped ("Raw Melody Men" and "Impurity") and I never strayed from NMA again.
Final impression:
"Hopeless Causes" was the album that got me back into New Model Army. That's a good thing. Always will have a soft spot in my heart for that album.
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Understand why NMA are millions of miles above everyone else (except The Beatles and Prince).
Or Katy Perry?
Kudos for the Prince reference though. Between 1984 and about 1994, the man was awesome.
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I think when you look back at albums they can be viewed in the time they were released and as a development of the/any band. If theyd carried on making "folk rock" after "post punk" (Im using labels loosely!), they may not be the band they are now and we wouldnt have got the albums we have now if that makes sense.
To me its a natural progression album, as they have all been. An album to break the mould and first away from EMI if I remember correctly. I love it. But then I love all of them.
On a personal not it was the second studio album I bought by them. Id heard the early stuff in my late teens but not really listened until Impurity. I cant remember how but I was on holiday in Somerset and played it to death. I got Raw Melody Men on the back of that and History but LOHC was the first "proper" album after those. And it bowled me over at a time I hit a low in life.
Ive already explained elsewhere how Bad Old World had an impact two years ago. Thats the mark of an album in my view.
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I loved Hopeless Causes right from the first listen. I don't think I could name an absolute favourite NMA album, but LOHC is certainly in the top 3. As well as some great songs (HCTW, Fate, White light, BOW especially, but amongst the others there's not one weak track) I really like the overall sound. Not quite sure what the correct terms would be, but it's bright and crisp and throbbing with energy. The production seems to match the power of the songs really well.
The only way I feel it could have been improved would have been by somehow sneaking Modern Times and Ghost of your Father in there as well. But maybe they had to be kept aside to fulfil the NMA tradition of magnificent B sides...
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I loved Hopeless Causes right from the first listen. I don't think I could name an absolute favourite NMA album, but LOHC is certainly in the top 3. As well as some great songs (HCTW, Fate, White light, BOW especially, but amongst the others there's not one weak track) I really like the overall sound. Not quite sure what the correct terms would be, but it's bright and crisp and throbbing with energy. The production seems to match the power of the songs really well.
The only way I feel it could have been improved would have been by somehow sneaking Modern Times and Ghost of your Father in there as well. But maybe they had to be kept aside to fulfil the NMA tradition of magnificent B sides...
Pretty much how I see it.
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Loved LOHC when i first got it and still a favourite to this day think the production on the album makes it great
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Odd one.
Didn't like Bob Clearmountain's mix when I first heard it and didn't get HCTW for years, used to start the album at track two, Fate.
Had a convo on the way to the Astoria in 2007 with someone and said it was my least fave album, she said it was one of her favourite albums.
So I revisited it throughout 2008 around the time the band played Stroud Subscription Rooms and I think I finally and belatedly 'got it'. I now play and sing about half of TLOHC on my acoustic and its one of my 13-year-old sons favourite NMA albums, and he pretty much loves them all, but TLOHC pre eminently.
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Despite not being one of my fave NMA albums, I could stomp around the streets listening to Here comes the war all day long.
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For me, I think the best way to sum it up is this:
I like LOHC more than I think I do. It's not really a go-to album, but when I do listen to it, I think it's pretty great.
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For me, I think the best way to sum it up is this:
I like LOHC more than I think I do. It's not really a go-to album, but when I do listen to it, I think it's pretty great.
Agreed.
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For me, I think the best way to sum it up is this:
I like LOHC more than I think I do. It's not really a go-to album, but when I do listen to it, I think it's pretty great.
Agreed.
Me to. Perhaps I should go there more often ;)
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I also love the sound of the album. it's definitely a loud album and really well recorded. I wish Impurity had sounded like LOHC does. And as for the songs, it has a few I consider "anthems" Here comes the war, my people, fate, the lyrics are excellent on this one. I remember reading in some mag that it sold really well in europe when it was first released. I can't say about the states. I have a feeling it was supposed to be their "breakout" album over here. It just didn't get on the radio where it would have won over a number of new fans(imho).
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LOHC was the 1st NMA album I brought so it has special memories for me. It was not the 1st NMA song I brought that was the 12 inch single of White Coats way back after I saw it on MTV. Anyway It will be my #1 NMA album. 8)
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When I finished reading all your accounts I came to the conclusion that the same happened to me: after being enthralled my everything NMA put out previously, I went out and bought LOHC without batting an eyelid. And lo and behold, my early disappointment when I ended listening to side two (yes, I bought the LP!), even though I enjoyed "Here Comes The War" and "White Light". But I kinda felt weird about "Understand U", "Living In The Rose" etc. Something was missing and I couldn't pinpoint it. I put it to rest and eventually got back to albums like "Thunder..." and "Impurity" to try and absorb the "shock". A few later spins and I found myself enjoying LOHC more and more and more... Now I simply love it all the way through. How do you explain that?
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When it was released I immediately found the first 4-5 songs to be powerful ones.
From HCTW to "White light" included the first tracks are really powerful, indeed! "Fate" is one of my fav NMA song...in the second half of the album, it's maybe "controversial" but i tend to like "Understand U" :-[..."The love of hopeless causes" is a really, really good album, and the sound production is great, clear, powerful.
I remember reading in some mag that it sold really well in europe when it was first released.
There was a very interesting, lengthy NMA/Justin interview in the US magazine The Big Takeover made in 1993, during the US tour, release of "The Love of Hopeless causes"...Justin was joking in the interview that the european "LOHC" tour went very well, so well in fact that they could afford loose tons of money, which they did, during the US tour!! ;D :'( ;)
I remember that in my country (France), this was the last time NMA had a decent "sized" tour before years and years (the "Strange Brotherhood" tour though had a few gigs in the big cities of the whole country, if i remember well)...TLOHC was the last time NMA had a 20 ranked album in the UK charts...before BDAW, 20 years later!
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Just a thought while listening this afternoon (song?) the cd in my car 8)...this year was "the love of hopeless causes"'s 25th birthday!! :o :D
Times goes by so fast...
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The post above from Space got it right.
At first a sad little album just released onto the public as though the band were embarrassed....but upon listening, a top album.
"Young money men play paint ball gaimzzz.
HERE COMES THE WARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!"
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Justin's interview for the album's release in June 1993:
http://the-revenge-of-riff-raff.blogspot.com/2013/07/interview-justin-sullivan-new-model-army.html
TLOHC's review, June 1993:
http://the-revenge-of-riff-raff.blogspot.com/2011/05/album-review-new-model-army-love-of.html
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A very interesting Justin Sullivan interview made during the US tour of TLOHC here in this issue:
(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0650/9105/products/bigtakeover_2263_22917883_1024x1024.jpg?v=1410637691)
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LOHC was the first album the band released whilst I was a fan if that makes sense? Think I was about 14 at the time and had only really heard the EMI singles compilation ( the one with Far Better Thing on it ). I really liked some of the songs but found it a little too tight in it's sound, perhaps a little over-produced. However its now definitely one of my favourites and gives, I believe, a real insight into the band at that time. Strange Brotherhood is a..Strange album. Its seems all over the place and unfocused but then throws out some of the finest songs they have ever recorded. Lullaby brings me to tears nearly every listen.
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Love of Hopeless Causes came out in a great time in my live so it will always be very special for me …
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I really liked some of the songs. its now definitely one of my favourites and gives, I believe, a real insight into the band at that time. Strange Brotherhood is a..Strange album. Its seems all over the place and unfocused but then throws out some of the finest songs they have ever recorded. Lullaby brings me to tears nearly every listen.
i agree with your opinion about TLOHC and STRANGE BROTHERHOOD..."Lullaby" is a beautiful song" indeed, never played live it seems, and i also love "Headlights".
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i agree with your opinion about TLOHC and STRANGE BROTHERHOOD..."Lullaby" is a beautiful song" indeed, never played live it seems, and i also love "Headlights".
Lullaby was actually played live, if too very rarely. I think I heard it only played two times live - 1995 in Düsseldorf and 1999 at Taubertal Festival. Maybe some more at solo gigs, but I don´t remember it properly...
K.
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I checked Stepanie`s archive - often very helpful informations
http://www.ne-ne.de/nmasongs/l.html#lullaby
Only 3 live gigs of lullaby listed...
But can`t believe LS 43 was never played live ???
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But can`t believe LS 43 was never played live ???
Due to setlist.fm LS43 was performed several times between 2004-2006. Must play Carnival again, probably the album I listen to most rarely.
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But can`t believe LS 43 was never played live ???
Due to setlist.fm LS43 was performed several times between 2004-2006. Must play Carnival again, probably the album I listen to most rarely.
I was the same, I sort of overlooked Carnival for many years, but got back into it a couple of years back and I can now recognise it as the absolute belter that it is... :)
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I was only 15 years old the day I bought the LOHC when it's released.I listened the whole album in a car by walkman on the road with my parents.Still very special to me.Changed lots of things in my life.From the first moment I heard Here Comes The War until the end of Bad Old World I remember I am amazed and listened the whole album over and over again till walkman gets broken.The "Sound " was the main thing made my mind the album is priceless.In years I even changed gear to sg guitars and vox amps.Proudly have the cd and vinyl signed by whole band.Great album and artwork.
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It's the thirtieth birthday of this excellent album this year so it's time to bring this topic up!