The Destruction of the NHS...

[ldopas]

It appears 13% of the hospital will be left ................ services to be farmed out across already overstretched local facilities .................... 

p.s. just shows you how long this destruction has been going on - and go google cos the lies are there as part of history.

And the stats:

http://www.nhsconfed.org/resources/key-statistics-on-the-nhs

So many figures about CHARING CROSS HOSPITAL there 

Although in fairness (cos I'm like that  ) perhaps my second post last night didn't make it clear I was still blithering on about CHX.

Still I'm convinced those stats are independently verified as an accurate statement of fact 

Yeah, I posted that because on one hand you have people using words like "destruction" and "privatisation" and on the other people who say its all ok don't worry. The stats show the issue is mixed and we need to talk about other things than money and who runs it. Things like how we deal with an expanding and ageing population's needs and use of those services. That was all! Charing Cross closing is bad, very bad, but on the other hand they have according to the NHS built a lot of new hospitals around the country in the last decade, many under Labour. 

And I hear you about stats, but until we have a better way of finding out which we have neither the time nor I suspect inclination its the best we got! (Having looked at the source first obviously).

[ldopas]

The real workers ie the doctors and nurses have done a brilliant job over the last few weeks especially.  Also a massive credit must go to the all the emergency services. Yes there has been huge cuts that would have made a massive difference

You are right about Doctors/Nurses, hell I would be six foot under without them. As for cuts, did you read the stats link I posted showing massive spending increases not cuts? Ok we can argue whether than cash input was enough and I would probably agree with you. But the issues are bigger than just cash surely? 

But we must have managers and admin staff otherwise you are asking Doctors and Nurses to do the admin.

[Anna Woman von NRW]

We can argue the toss about figures and stats till the cows come home and we'd still end up none the wiser. I could link to figures relating to proportion of GDP or historical financing or relation to true cost of living but someone could just come back with another set of numbers proving the exact opposite. Depends what thinktank your allegiances lie with. Smokescreens and diversion from all sides - nobody actually has a monopoly on the truth regardless of what the tory party may claim.

I have also benefited from a magnificent NHS, without which I very much doubt I'd have made it this far. The NHS is an achievement that the United Kingdom should rightly be proud of and which it should be very very wary of destroying in the guise of the god of neo-liberalism which it IS doing. Some things are beyond the tenet of profit. They are are a social cost which all have to bear.

But we must have managers and admin staff otherwise you are asking Doctors and Nurses to do the admin.

Hate to say it but I agree, viewed in capitalist terms the NHS is one massive corporation and as such it has to have people in the background who make the whole damn thing function. Without them I would never have got to see the Doctors, Shrinks, Consultants and ultimately Surgeons who healed me. There is surely a debate to be had regarding the numbers and efficiency same as in any other organisation but lets not kid ourselves that something as huge as the NHS can manage without them.

I would suggest that folks have a really close look at how health care is organised outside of the UK. Be very careful of what is casually thrown away because I doubt it can easily be replaced.

[Pol]

im sure we can all agree that the nhs has got worse/ a lot worse in real terms , longer waitin lists poor conditions for staff n the sick . yes there is no easy answers with a growing population n poeple living longer , brexit will cost us many good staff

[Anna Woman von NRW]

Anyone seen the recently "revealed" proposals for London and other parts of the country ? Hmmm ...

[Master Ray]

Anyone seen the recently "revealed" proposals for London and other parts of the country ? Hmmm ...

I did.  It doesn't look good... and let's face it, reappointing someone for Secretary Of State For Health who once wrote down his plans for disassembling the NHS is a pretty clear indication of where the Tories are going... isn't this shit a bit bloody obvious?   

[Anna Woman von NRW]

Anyone seen the recently "revealed" proposals for London and other parts of the country ? Hmmm ...

I did.  It doesn't look good... and let's face it, reappointing someone for Secretary Of State For Health who once wrote down his plans for disassembling the NHS is a pretty clear indication of where the Tories are going... isn't this shit a bit bloody obvious?   

Quite, but don't you go spouting none of your lefty "magic money tree" bullshit  round here fella - it's all about the profit, do keep up old boy 

[ldopas]

Turnover is vanity, profit is sanity. You know how it goes. However you also know you naughty people  that the NHS is not meant to make a profit. If we in the private sector make no profit we are dead, plus of course stuff like new equipment investment, training, staff salary increases, expansion and all that crucial stuff goes bye bye.

But I take your point. Personally I think the NHS and private sector shouldn't mix, not coz I'm a socialist because you know I'm definitely not, but because it is poison for both sides. I rarely bid for public sector jobs, though we have won a Welsh government contract in the last year and we are on the shortlist to get some work from Hinkley Point (fingers crossed). Bidding for public sector jobs is a mindf*ck of paperwork, diversity targetting and endless demands that stop you getting the job done properly.

[Anna Woman von NRW]

However you also know you naughty people  that the NHS is not meant to make a profit.

No it's not - but that is something that  to the governments shame it seems to have forgotten 

If we in the private sector make no profit we are dead, plus of course stuff like new equipment investment, training, staff salary increases, expansion and all that crucial stuff goes bye bye.

Ain't the private sector though is it? Those costs are part and parcel of running such a social service.

I rarely bid for public sector jobs,

Don't blame ya' I never did either  But because a SME can never compete with the resources of a larger corporation not because I thought that this:

diversity targetting

was shite.

we are on the shortlist to get some work from Hinkley Point (fingers crossed)

mmmmmmm..............