EMI Albums - production - thoughts??

[JohnnyM]

Anyone have any thoughts on why the EMI albums seem to have been so difficult to make? I loved them at the time - but looking back and with the benefit of hindsight & interviews...

No Rest has great tunes (poss my fave album) - but the production is shocking… though maybe just too much of its time (more reverb & echoey-ness? certainly sir..)

The next two album feature two of rocks great producers, Tom Dowd & Glynn Johns, but obviously things didn't go to plan, and I've got a vague memory from interviews that there was fair bit of tension in the studio and the resulting effect is a bit of a hootch porch (but great tunes of course).

I think Impurity was self produced - though not sure of the engineer input but sounds the best.

Anyway - any thoughts, or even better, comments from those who were there, very welcome

[Stoney]

A good producer nearly always has ideas that one or more of a band will hate......... Especialy the main writer of whatever song is being disected........
Glyn Johns and Tom Dowd are rightfully huge names in the field, and it was a big feather in NMA's cap to work with them at the time. It's not just about money, those two names get to choose who they work with, because they have worked on HUGELY popular records over decades......... They undoubtaby have an ear for good songs and good studio sounds. Both those lp's SOUND as good now as they did then to me. They haven't aged particularly, because the producers have a much longer track record than "names" of the 80's production style. They go back to late 60's/early 70's lp's, some REALLY GOOD ONES at that!......
I think NMA's Northern Soul/Folk heritage of song writing helped take them some where else sonically, than alot other's 80's Alt' heroes........ Dunno, just my opinion.
Impurity bears lots of halmarks lifted from the two previous lp's, with other bits thrown in. I think Rob n Justin learned alot from the experience of working with the 2 names mentioned. Rob definately had a great ear, Justin sez he's half deaf, but I don't believe that affects how you FEEL a song. If you know what I mean? I think he hears way more than he lets on! =)
Being a producer isn't just the sound of the record anyway, it's the structure of songs aswell...... Just have a look at the Classic Albums dvd series. They are hugely interesting if you are involved on writing music. I love them. There's lots to learn from stuff like that fer my money.

[JohnnyM]

I'm not sure about Ghost of Cain - but Thunder & Consolation seems to have been a bit of a trauma - it seems as if relations had broken down properly as  only half the tracks on the finished album are produced by Tom Dowd. It must be difficult to let go of tunes you've written & played for ages.. but then again whats the point of getting a big producer in who will do just that?

[Stoney]

Thunder was, as I recall mentioned as being hardwork. But nothing like the hell that Strange Brotherhood sounded like............... I really felt for the newer guys being in that situation. I can't imagine Dave having a great time while the band was at loggerheads in the studio..........
I didn't envy him that at all, no matter how much I'd love to be in the band..........
It's really weird, coz a few of the songs had been played a fair bit before recording, but it sounds like tension central hit town at studio time...........

[JohnnyM]

It's really weird, coz a few of the songs had been played a fair bit before recording, but it sounds like tension central hit town at studio time...........

I think the band was basically going off in different directions at that point - hence the random nature of the album. (Sad) events dictated that Robb left shortly afterwards - but if he hadnt - i wouldnt have been surprised if the band hadnt of broken up (which they were on the point of).

But slightly going off point from the big name producers of the 80s!

[huwcamden]

I went round daves house in 1997 with a view to playing some guitar for his own band and he was be-moaning the fact that nma had actually split up 3 times around then so strange brotherhood must have been a ***** to get out, but i kind of like its rough edges and awkwardness, sort of a wounded phoenix rising from the ashes, you knew from then nma would survive anything and that many more monster albums were to come, to me it was probally as important an album as there debut cos of that.

[Pazza]

Anyone have any thoughts on why the EMI albums seem to have been so difficult to make? I loved them at the time - but looking back and with the benefit of hindsight & interviews...

No Rest has great tunes (poss my fave album) - but the production is shocking… though maybe just too much of its time (more reverb & echoey-ness? certainly sir..)

The next two album feature two of rocks great producers, Tom Dowd & Glynn Johns, but obviously things didn't go to plan, and I've got a vague memory from interviews that there was fair bit of tension in the studio and the resulting effect is a bit of a hootch porch (but great tunes of course).

I think Impurity was self produced - though not sure of the engineer input but sounds the best.

Anyway - any thoughts, or even better, comments from those who were there, very welcome

Strangely timely, as have been having a bit of a re run of the No Rest album this past week, I think it was the band playing Frightened at Bilston what dunnit.

The production on No Rest has always grated with me slightly, things like the long fade out on My Country, and it's one of the reasons it's not on my top list of NMA all time albums. Impurity is a great album in my view, songs, listing order, production, artwork, time it came into my life, I could go on but won't.

There are some great songs on No Rest and for some reason it feels to me like it could and should have been higher up the all time NMA ranking list.

Still, music is all about opinions and the different ways we hear things. Carnival is one of my top NMA albums and I know some fans don't rate it so highly.

All interesting discussion tho! And something to while away the hours til's the waiting's over on Thursday night...   ; ~ D

[Dreadnought]

No rest has a great production, for someone like me, living on a island in Greece, it has this "english rainy, cold, frustrating" sound that got me hooked up with the band in the first place. GoC always sounde a bit "flat", and as for Strange brotherhood, which btw is my least favourite album but with  some of my most favourite songs, it  sounds "scattered" ...
Impurity i think has the best sound of them all, just perfect but T&C was,is and always will be my favourite NMA album.

[szmurf]

Thunder and Ghost are tops in my book.  Don't know what you guys are talking about.

[Guillaume]

My fav NMA albums were, are and i think always will be THUNDER AND CONSOLATION and THE GHOST OF CAIN.
I think that THUNDER AND CONSOLATION sounds really good, i like the sound of the bass, guitars and drums in this album.
The other fine sound production in NMA 's discography is THE LOVE OF HOPELESS CAUSES...the sound of this album is really cool!
NO REST FOR THE WICKED is a really good album too, but the sound is very agressive, very 80's, it makes my ears bleed ha ha! 

GoC always sounde a bit "flat", and as for Strange brotherhood, which btw is my least favourite album but with  some of my most favourite songs, it  sounds "scattered" ...

I like the sound of THE GHOST OF CAIN, but the first cd before the remastered edition had a "small", low sound.
I don't like too much the sound of STRANGE BROTHERHOOD...one of NMA's most uneven albums, too.

[tyrd]

hhmmm I'm looking for any opinion about the remastered cd's, and i can't find anything, anything to say? since they're not remixed, any difference at all?

[JohnnyM]

Thunder and Ghost are tops in my book.  Don't know what you guys are talking about.

We were talking about the albums being difficult to make - not the tunes (which are great, obviously)

[Willard]

hhmmm I'm looking for any opinion about the remastered cd's, and i can't find anything, anything to say? since they're not remixed, any difference at all?

I think three of the remasters are excellent, though there seems to be a real issue with warbling on Inpurity.  The main issue is with keyboard tracks.  It's a dealbreaker for me, unfortunately 

The other three are great, real improvements.  Ghost of Cain I think is the biggest improvement, cleaner and you can hear the drums, in particular, much better.  Also, while I am cognizant of the "loudness wars", the remasters are up to a modern standard, and match later NMA albums.

For what it's worth, I think Today is a Good Day was mastered way too loud, loads of compression/clipping.  I hope the new release fares better.

The 2-cd reissues are getting very hard to get, although you can get most as digital downloads from various (legitimate) outlets.