will modern technology kill film music and television

[Master Ray]

OK, gonna BUMP this one...

... in view of the way so many people are choosing 'streaming' over actually buying a DVD or Blu or whatever...

I do appreciate the convenience of it all. Click on a link and it's right there for you! But I'd much rather have a hard copy of the entertainment I love (preferably with nice packaging and all, a solid artifact...)

Netflix, in the US, just deleted much of their movie choices to pay for their new programmes.  Fine... Daredevil and Better Call Saul were excellent!  But if you wanted to watch any of the films they deleted...?

Streaming is dependant on the whims of the people controlling the product.  And as more corperations buy up more product, it becomes increasingly unlikely that at a full choice of things will be available...

Modern Technology?  Fine... in it's place.

[Pol]

I suppose it all comes down to money, I don't have Netflix etc, most of my hard copies I buy cheaply as possible second hand with a few exceptions once I've finished with them I normally donate them to the charity shop.
I do watch a bit of youtube live gigs etc it certainly makes me think twice a similar live dvd by a lot of these bands. The problem with Netflix is if you pay a bit extra you can share the account with friends etc , and if your smart you buy a android tv box, jailbreak a tv stick add kodi/xbmc and watch for free. The younger more tech savvy generation think its crazy to pay when they don't have to

[Bunny]

I think personally, despite all the noise, downloads etc have made no difference. Some films etc make tens of millions on their initial release. If downloads made such a difference would blockbusters still be possible?? I personally dont think so. I dare say there is some financial implication but I dont think its as big as being made out. Yes its illegal. But balance that with say the last Fantastic 4 film, which is apparently crap. If Id payed cinema costs, as some have, and found a film crap, Id have lost money. So for me its swings and roundabouts....(incidentally I havent seen it!!). Likewise music.

Buy an album/ cd scratched and you dont like it, or have to replace it and its money lost.

I think digital ownership is the way forward at prices that are affordable, particularily for home use.

And again, as Ive said before, who in the 80's didnt record from radio to cassette. Same principle. Illegal? Yes.

[Pol]

Your blockbuster films are still going to be ok and you can't really repeat the whole cinema experience at home,  its more the dvd market especially the smaller independent films that's going to suffer.
Same with music a few bigger bands and well established bands are going to be ok , its your smaller bands that are going to struggle though the internet can definitely help a few

[Shush]

In the recent interview that can be found on here with JS, he talks about how modern technology is effecting music today. Something called spotify ??. No idea what it is so I asked my son. Apparently you can select songs to listen to for free. If you want to avoid having adverts in your play list, you can pay a little extra and just have the music. As JS was saying, there can be a new generation that does not own a physical record / CD collection and not even pay for what they choose to listen to. He also commented that bands these days make so little on record sales, hence so many bands are now touring more often to make it pay.

Personally, maybe its my age or my hoarding instinct, I like to have a brought and paid for collection of CD's / records even though I only really play it via MP3, I am comfortable with the knowledge I own a physical copy as back-up if needed.

[lotus]

Your blockbuster films are still going to be ok and you can't really repeat the whole cinema experience at home,  its more the dvd market especially the smaller independent films that's going to suffer.
Same with music a few bigger bands and well established bands are going to be ok , its your smaller bands that are going to struggle though the internet can definitely help a few

Yes Pol,
if you have only some hundred fans, free Spotify or Youtube are perfect to win some more fans - but to continue your work (music or cinema), you can`t continue with this "free downloads" - you have to sell real copies of a cd, dvd, right for streaming, a fan shop, tickets (cinema or gigs) ....
I have a normal job and want to get payed for my work to pay my bills - why should artists work for nothing and have no money to pay their bills to lead a "normal" live and working on things I love and forgetting all the bad things of my normal job for some hours?

[Anna Woman von NRW]

Thing is though - the genie is out of the bottle now. Technical wizardry stuff will not go away. Appealing to folks better nature to pay if they don't have to is like weeing in the wind 

[Mike]

I have a normal job and want to get payed for my work to pay my bills - why should artists work for nothing and have no money to pay their bills to lead a "normal" live and working on things I love and forgetting all the bad things of my normal job for some hours?

I think you are assuming a purpose for music here that it doesn't really have. It is artistic expression first and foremost, very little without that. It is not necessarily work and it is not necessarily for your consumption, benefit or distraction. Those things are bonuses.

The notion that one has to go full time to be a successful musician on your own terms, let alone anyone else's, puts people off doing it. My band are going great at the moment and we'd be nowhere were it not for free distribution of our music and affordable technologies to make it with. But we don't do it full time. We work in offices, hospitals, bike shops... and frankly having done the touring circuit with some pretty large acts I prefer this.

If you can make a living just from your music then great, I'm happy for you. But I cannot abide people who slog away at it getting nowhere by whatever arbitrary yardstick they've adopted and then complain about it, as if there's some entitlement to be able to do it for a living, simply because you are good at it. The same is not true of any other vocation, most of which aren't governed by ficklenesses like taste and trend.

[Mike]

In any case, the old model can't support the breadth of artists who are now able to make things by virtue of technology democratising creativity and allowing anyone with a PC to have a go.

This film explores the issue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rvlaTg3vPg

Personally I'll gladly bid farewell to the guitar shop> rehersal room > pub > A&R ****** > Evil corporation > Top of the Pops route and enjoy the me > everyone route.

I've seen both from inside and I know which makes people happiest and least dysfunctional.

[Master Ray]

Mike... couple of great and interesting posts there, thanks!  And glad your band is doing well, good luck, I'm sure you've posted this info before, but what are you called, so I can have a listen and maybe check you out live if you're playing anywhere near me?  Always glad to support the up-and-comers!

A couple of points (yeah, here I go...  )

You mention how bands should work to keep their passion afloat.  Rightly so!  But what if there is little or no work where a band are?  Zero-hour contracts, minimum wage if you're lucky, the dole queue if you're not.  Roofs still need to be kept over heads and bellies still need to be filled.  The world where I am (your experience may differ) is full of people right down to the bones of their arses, struggling to afford to keep their internet connection on, much less the technology to make music.  Likewise, I used to be in a band (a long time ago  ) and I still remember it costs money!  Yes, rehersal studios, guitar strings, etc... What if you have no money?  For all the usual stuff, not least transport to venues and petrol to put in the same van!  Speaking of which, there are very few venues near me that want to put on original music, so you would have to travel a long way to play (for f-all money) in a van you can't afford... it's going around in circles now, isn't it?   

It's lovely to put the money thing out of the equation and do it for love.  But some folks (and I suspect that NMA would be included, back when they were just young lads) want to devote themselves full-time to the whole music thing, bring their stuff to a wider audience and concentrate on developing their music and their art, not working in hospitals and bike shops and whatever.  And for that, they need every scrap of cash that comes their way...

Again, sorry, this wasn't supposed to be a dismissive thread. And I wish you all the best. 

[Heno]

couple of impending realities

everyone will pay for everything. our generation are probably the last whereby the foundation of our media collections are in hard copy.

record labels, publishers, producers.....they are all going to work for the telcos at the end of the day. look at bt and sky in the uk. it is clear where its going. small number of massively powerful corporations that own the infrastructure for media. and the content is no different to light, electric, water, gas. they will simply meter you based on number of screens or speakers you have.

hdmi laid the foundation. it is the smartest thing the bastards have done and we've all lapped it up in the interests of device inter-operability and image quality. buried deep in the silicon of hdmi ports is a unique ID. unique in the whole world, not just to certain equipment manufacturers. and devices can read this ID which it turns they can say if the device is permitted to play the content or not. 

and even when they day its free - its not really free. you pay for the internet connection. you pay for the data usage that is higher for streaming especially when using the likes of spotify where you will likely play the same song multiple times meaning it costs every time as opposed to once if you have a physical copy. you pay for the equipment.  and the telcos love to serve you with the content because its easy to deliver and it some ways makes their pricing appear like value because of its opaque presentation.

to be honest, the live music industry would be so much more vibrant from an alternative or indie standpoint if we had more suited, better, cheaper venues and cheaper beer. for now fashion has won out. 

[lotus]

Thanks Heno,
my thoughts ...
HDMI, tv via internet, a smart tv - it`s nor free - I have to pay with my identity and money for the provider
a tv and usb or hdd recording - shite, you buy a new tv and in most cases all recordings are lost (all the devices say unknown format)
But it`s better to forget these old songs, movies - new new products are better (free trailers, free downloads to buy something in our internet shop)
Most of us try not to spent too much energy, but these internet server farms and our mobile devices need so much energy
That`s a kind of "putting out fire with gasoline" we all have to pay in the end for this

(perhaps my blueray player doesn`t allow me to watch my hard copy of Soylent Green in 2022)

[Pol]

Agreed totally with the last too posts , yes most of want hardware and its easy to get sucked into the consumer market, hey I do it myself. Now today I seen in paper a certain German supermarket selling a 40 inch 4k ultra hd tv for £299 n thought wow that's cheap.
Now to my point whilst nothing is free the money is going to wrong people artists need to survive to be creative without artists where does that leave us

[jc]

Interesting article about how the value of music has gone down due to technology and proliferation.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34268474

Interesting thing he says in that the only thing that we can't proliferate is time, so keep on going to those gigs.


Cheers

jc