EU Referendum

[lotus]

sorry, that joke - is fine for you to pay less, but not  for the brexit/remain ones - they have to deal with that and a lot of voters didn`t know that this will happen 

Why?
English pound is down and ordering is cheaper ?

Well I was sort of making a joke, but it actually IS cheaper now than when I ordered it before - I just ordered myself a second package I am going to give to a friend here.
About 7 American dollars cheaper. This time, with shipping it is 78 dollars for the package.

[Rusco]

Oh, woke up today and heard the news in a terrible hangover.

Strange to hear this. As I've said I've been always on behalf of getting out of power unions whether what they are but just recently I've maybe been moved a bit by some quite good opinions about staying. Then this happens. To be honest, I'm not so sure anymore was it good... But let's try to be positive and expect good things, brothers and sisters.

[Sequoia225]

sorry, that joke - is fine for you to pay less, but not  for the brexit/remain ones - they have to deal with that and a lot of voters didn`t know that this will happen 

Look, Im on the West Coast of America and despite being married to a family of different European immigrants, I am pretty removed from this - admittedly. But, how did so many not know this would happen when I read so many comments here (just this morning - havent logged on in a long time) that people seem to have been pretty on the fence about all this? What exactly do they have to "deal with"?
Educate me.

[Master Ray]

OK.  A surprising result.  And I did stay up until about 3am, but really thought the REMAIN voters would win it in the end when the London votes came through.

They didn't, but it was so close.  It could easily have gone the other way.  In my silly opinion, what lost it was the REMAIN campaign and their so-called (by the general media) 'Project Fear' campaign. 

They could have presented a rational, sensible and reasonably calm argument.  Nope.  The arrogant bastards laid it on thick with talk of a new world war, the pound falling to the worth of a few buttons, a gazillion non-whites moving in next door to YOU, human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria! (yes, I'm now quoting GHOSTBUSTERS, that's now despairing I am of the whole thing  ).  Most intelligent people could see through it and make their own minds up.  But that tiny (yet, crucially, VITAL) few percent were antagonised, annoyed and took a knee-jerk reaction into the OUT box.

I can't deny it.  I voted out, as I've said before.  And I stand by my vote for calm and rational reasons that I'm not going to debate until this whole thing calms down.  Too many people are upset today.

The REMAIN campaign blew it for themselves.  Cameron's out?  Fine, he can call his mate Tony B on how to make bundles of cash after being forced out of your job because you're an f-ing embarrassment (he'll be fine...  )

What I can't stand are the sore Remainers who are accusing 52% of this countries voters as being racist, under-educated and practically worthless...

Oh, and there's no guarantee that Boris will be the next Prime Minister, plenty of other Tories tossers will come crawling out of the woodwork to say 'Hey, look at me, I'd be AWESOME at being PM, I went to Oxford and the Bullingdon Club...' 

Wow... what a day. Regardless of whichever way you think it will go, you have to admit it's a historic one.





 

[Pol]

What kinda got me that the vote was won by 1.4m votes, when 2.8m vapers ecig users were totally ignored, they had the chance to change ignore the tdp it wasn't even a full European law but a directive a couple of weeks. Lord Callan put the wheels in motion but labour wouldn't back it. I'm not saying for a second that was the only reason behind their vote, but as someone who is active on some vaping forums and watches related youtube stuff a lot of people were fcking angry. The whole thing certainly gave me a lesson in what unelected European committee's were capable of. Who knows maybe it would have made a difference

[Pumpkin]

Never in British politics has there been worse leadership than Cameron and Corbyn on an internal issue. Both men were against the EU, then when party leadership came a-calling, they conveniently forgot this. Both men conveniently forgot how Euro-scepticism has loomed large in British politics since the end of WWII in both parties. They were both hopeless during the campaign.

Cameron couldn't even control the issue in his own party and he failed to learn the lessons behind the downfall of both Thatcher and Major where Tory infighting over the EU proved fatal. He was always a lightweight in this and in way too deep for his own good. Euro-scepticism took down much more experienced and hardened Tory leaders.

Likewise, Corbyn had a convenient 'forgetful moment' when he signed up to "Remain" that he himself was probably one of the most obvious "Leave" campaigners in town. In fact, he had built much of his career on it. He forgot that Labour were always the leaders in Euro-sceptisim; he turned his back on his grassroots; he now pays the price. The bread and butter Labour base has had more than enough of being sidelined by careerists and Blairites. When it got someone who 'seemed' (and I use the term lightly) authentic to old Labour values, they got their eye wiped again. Corbyn has even cost the party Scotland - an amazing fact when you think how Labour monopolised Scotland for yonks.

I never had any time for either, so I was delighted to see both pull on the "Remain" kit. The two of them, with barely a teaspoon of sincerity between them, were a gift to the "Leave" campaign...yet I still thought they would squeak out a victory, especially with every single major international institution backing them. Given this, the fact they didn't succeed is an opportunity for the rest of the EU member states to examine their own relationship with the EU. Whatever anyone thinks of Farage and Johnson, you couldn't discount the fact they were more committed to their cause than Cameron or Corbyn. They certainly had a greater desire to win.

Who knows...this might be the beginning of 1989 for Western Europe now; in other words, Brussels loses their satellite states to popular uprisings. Only time will tell.

As far as I'm concerned, the EU got the serious blow it well deserved. In fact, it has been 'courting' it for years.

[Bunny]

OK.  A surprising result.  And I did stay up until about 3am, but really thought the REMAIN voters would win it in the end when the London votes came through.

They didn't, but it was so close.  It could easily have gone the other way.  In my silly opinion, what lost it was the REMAIN campaign and their so-called (by the general media) 'Project Fear' campaign. 

They could have presented a rational, sensible and reasonably calm argument.  Nope.  The arrogant bastards laid it on thick with talk of a new world war, the pound falling to the worth of a few buttons, a gazillion non-whites moving in next door to YOU, human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria! (yes, I'm now quoting GHOSTBUSTERS, that's now despairing I am of the whole thing  ).  Most intelligent people could see through it and make their own minds up.  But that tiny (yet, crucially, VITAL) few percent were antagonised, annoyed and took a knee-jerk reaction into the OUT box.

I can't deny it.  I voted out, as I've said before.  And I stand by my vote for calm and rational reasons that I'm not going to debate until this whole thing calms down.  Too many people are upset today.

The REMAIN campaign blew it for themselves.  Cameron's out?  Fine, he can call his mate Tony B on how to make bundles of cash after being forced out of your job because you're an f-ing embarrassment (he'll be fine...  )

What I can't stand are the sore Remainers who are accusing 52% of this countries voters as being racist, under-educated and practically worthless...

Oh, and there's no guarantee that Boris will be the next Prime Minister, plenty of other Tories tossers will come crawling out of the woodwork to say 'Hey, look at me, I'd be AWESOME at being PM, I went to Oxford and the Bullingdon Club...' 

Wow... what a day. Regardless of whichever way you think it will go, you have to admit it's a historic one.

Michael Gove has been touted. God help us.

Well I aint a sore remainer, but Im devastated. Absolutely devastated. I do think we'll be ok long term, but jesus the news is bleak right now. We just need Cornwall to declare independence and we've got a full set. Im gonna hibernate a few months i think.

I will just add, as Ive said before, migration was the key issue for me. Rightfully, people have concerns re housing, the changing face of Britain etc etc, and I wouldnt be stupid enough to call it racist. Its not. It wasnt a recipe for success for sure. But hey its done. We move on.

[Pumpkin]

Actually, a lot of the so-called 'untouchable' subjects were very much an issue in this. It was a nasty campaign, but emotions are running high for a lot of people after years of being ignored. This is where Labour really failed - trying to sweep it under the carpet...

I wouldn't be surprised if the Tories go for a virtual unknown next...seems to be the pattern.

[ldopas]

Never in British politics has there been worse leadership than Cameron and Corbyn on an internal issue.

Amen to that brother! 

[ldopas]

Actually, a lot of the so-called 'untouchable' subjects were very much an issue in this. It was a nasty campaign, but emotions are running high for a lot of people after years of being ignored. This is where Labour really failed - trying to sweep it under the carpet...

I wouldn't be surprised if the Tories go for a virtual unknown next...seems to be the pattern.

Well whoever it is of whatever political colour, they had better be laser focussed and clear on where we go from here. I won't lie, part of me is happy we went out, but a larger part of me is very worried about my business. Being in construction, certainly linked to projects that use Spanish, Portugese, German etc as well as UK contract staff we have just jumped off a cliff where we cannot see the bottom for mist and verbiage.

So whoever it is had better bloody start clearing that mist and ensuring our trade agreements are in place as soon as possible. The possibility of damage to our credit rating (as has already started) and barriers to trade will be so damaging it will make the early 1980s look like a kids party! One that we may never recover from.

Certainly I have spent the weekend with colleague looking at spending less, shoring up current projects and discussing strategy. I absolutely won't be spending on new projects until I see where we are going. And I suspect most businesses are doing the same, which will do the economy no good at all.

Scotland independence calls all the time have become like tinnitus to me, sorry Pol!    But they may have the right idea. Because if they do go independent and are allowed back into the EU, then business will flow through Scotland out of England and Wales. The opposite of what might have happened if they had voted for independence last time. Perhaps?

BUT before everyone gets too depressed, I am an optimist and I think you should be too. We are a talented bunch, with a sly self deprecation on these islands and I think we will come through it better. My issue is in what timescale. My guess is we will lash some quasi deal together with the EU that isn't quite independence. We will see.

[Johnz]

I am truly saddened by this. There is a certain irony in the fact that many of those who voted 'leave' will bear the greatest impact of its implications. So it probably won't be all that exciting for the low waged or those in the periphery etc. but there you are. I also know that most people who voted 'leave' are not uneducated, racist bigots but the fact remains that this plays right into the hands of the far right all across Europe.

As far as Scotland is concerned they shouldn't rush into anything. I also doubt that a second referendum would yield a different result. With all this uncertainty it will most likely be a case of 'better the devil you know'. But who knows.

I don't want to add to all the ugliness that is unfolding everywhere. It's done now. Time to get on with things to make sure that this doesn't turn into an even greater mess. To that extent it is paramount that the actual Brexit is as swift as possible. I fear that it will be two years of procrastination and endless bartering.

[Master Ray]

Jeez... these 'remain' folks demanding a second referendum... 

I appreciate their upset, truly I do, and I respect their opinion and anger.  There is the possibility of both good and bad scenarios after Thursdays result.  Whatever happens, so be it.

But, FFS, this isn't the X-Factor.  You can't appeal to Simon in the hope of a bit of 'weepy-face' will change the result.

A lot of people feel aggrieved because a 52% majority on a 72% voter turnout means that only 37.44% of the British voting population voted to leave the European Union.  I get that.  But only 35.52% voted to stay in.  Or, to put it another way, over a million people chose OUT rather than IN.  Also, only 72% of the UK voted?  Then the opinions of the other 28% are worthless, if they couldn't be arsed to vote, then bollocks to them. 

You can't change the rules after the game is over.

But what the heck... let's have a second referendum (emphasis on DUMB)... if the remainers win it, well... best out of three?  And so it will go on... 

It's done and dusted.  Accept it.

[Pol]

Agreed internet petitions have gone to far this time. Real democracy has spoken. Its not fcking facebook the unlike button means nothing

[Shush]

"In the name of the people"

[ldopas]

Agreed internet petitions have gone to far this time. Real democracy has spoken. Its not fcking facebook the unlike button means nothing

Exactly!

If the 71% of under 25s who DIDN'T vote had bothered to get off their lazy arses and vote, we wouldn't be having this conversation anyway. If you cannot be bloody bothered, don't complain when you don't get the result you want.