Author Topic: EU Referendum  (Read 18108 times)

Pol

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #255 on: June 26, 2016, 09:39:20 AM »
Very sad that 71% of under 25s didn't vote, I guess that they were too busy liking cute cats on facebook.
See the labour party have also started to implode, Hilary Benn sacked n half the shadow cabinet resigning worrying times with the Tories split in two.
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Wessexy Witch

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #256 on: June 26, 2016, 10:27:02 AM »
I made sure my 22 year old voted.
I took him with me.
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Bunny

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #257 on: June 26, 2016, 11:34:51 AM »
While I wholly agree,.if I can play devils advocate, the outies banged a continual drum that they wanted out, and got a referendum. Who therefore is to say, and has the right to say that at some point in the future (not now) opinions will change and the country may look to go back?  Nothing is ever set. Im fairly.confident if remain won, that wouldnt be the end of it, so i think a little bit of reason and understanding is not unwarranted. For now it is what it is and I accept that. I do know of families that have fell out over it  :-\
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fairloveorwar

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #258 on: June 26, 2016, 12:45:02 PM »
ha..'better the devil you know'..a woman next to me at the bank talking to the teller said that exact same thing as she handed in a huge wad of money...( not saying she ddn't earn it..just thought it was funny)
given the growing inequality in distribution of wealth it's easy to see why the map demograhic shows that only the affluent cities and the posh areas north of london had a higher percentage o 'ins'. The increase in this inequality has been getting steadily worse since we joined the EU...have to worry that that isn't going to change regardless now
but yes, we really need to be focussed now instead of all this usual negativity and sour grapes..:p
« Last Edit: June 26, 2016, 12:46:55 PM by fairloveorwar »

Master Ray

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #259 on: June 26, 2016, 07:28:21 PM »
Agreed internet petitions have gone to far this time. Real democracy has spoken. Its not fcking facebook the unlike button means nothing

Exactly!

If the 71% of under 25s who DIDN'T vote had bothered to get off their lazy arses and vote, we wouldn't be having this conversation anyway. If you cannot be bloody bothered, don't complain when you don't get the result you want.

Agreed!  I heard the figure was more like 64%, but the point still stands.  If they could have dragged themselves from f-ing Instagram (or whatever 'dem kids' are into nowadays) and actually VOTED, who knows, it might have tipped the result.  I keep reading posts on other Forums about how 'the old' ruined the future of the youngsters by voting leave... NO!  They ruined it for themselves!  Hell, they didn't even have to do anything as basic as showing up at a polling station, they could have registered for a postal vote and done it at their convenience!

And, please, don't anyone use the excuse that 'well, they're young, they didn't understand...'   ::)  If you're over 18, you're an adult and with that comes adult responsibilities. Decades ago, someone of a similar age would be sent to fight a fuckin' war. I'm seeing a lot of spoilt children in adult bodies just moaning, basically.

Yes, I am officially a grumpy old man, but you know, make your bed etc.
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Pol

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #260 on: June 26, 2016, 07:39:18 PM »
Aye we had to stay off the voters roll to avoid the poll tax lol
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Bunny

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #261 on: June 26, 2016, 07:40:25 PM »
Jesus wept. This country is on the verge of ripping itself apart. If the nastiness before was bad, it was nothing. What a bloody horrible, bitter country we are becoming.


On an aside, has anyone seen George Osbourne?  ;D
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Master Ray

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #262 on: June 26, 2016, 07:52:28 PM »
Jesus wept. This country is on the verge of ripping itself apart. If the nastiness before was bad, it was nothing. What a bloody horrible, bitter country we are becoming.


On an aside, has anyone seen George Osbourne?  ;D

Ha!  Yes, old Ozzy does seem to be keeping a low profile... haven't seen much of Davey Boy since Friday either...

Perhaps they're in hiding in a little caravan somewhere, huddled around a little heater and saying 'well, we fucked that one up, didn't we?'   :D
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lotus

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #263 on: June 26, 2016, 08:04:21 PM »
Only find some german sources about voters and age -
More than 70% of the younger ones voted and most of these ones wanted to remain  ???
Could someone please post a link of the statistic other way round?

Agreed internet petitions have gone to far this time. Real democracy has spoken. Its not fcking facebook the unlike button means nothing

Exactly!

If the 71% of under 25s who DIDN'T vote had bothered to get off their lazy arses and vote, we wouldn't be having this conversation anyway. If you cannot be bloody bothered, don't complain when you don't get the result you want.
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Master Ray

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #264 on: June 26, 2016, 08:39:16 PM »
This seems to be fairly accurate... yes, 36% of 18-24 voted and only 58% of 25-34 year olds... let me know if the link doesn't work and I'll try again...

https://twitter.com/SkyData/status/746700869656256512



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MARKXE

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #265 on: June 26, 2016, 09:01:50 PM »
Maybe Mr Osborne should read this.

"Hello, world. Britain has dared to dream and is open for business

article by rohan silva

Three swift confidence-boosting measures will convince people at home and investors abroad that we have a dynamic future

The “leave” campaign’s slogan was “take control”. Well, now we truly are in control. I don’t mean that in the narrow sense of taking control of certain policy areas from the EU. I mean that we’re in charge of our own fate as a country. The choice we make about how we react to Thursday’s momentous vote will affect the lives of everyone in Britain, and we have to get it right.

If we perpetuate the negativity and scaremongering of much of the campaign, there’s a very good chance we’ll turn the warnings of Project Fear into a self-fulfilling prophesy. As Franklin D Roosevelt put it: “The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.”

On the other hand, if we come together behind a positive new agenda — in particular for the economy — we can make a reality of the optimistic vision of Britain outside the EU put forward by some “leave” campaigners.

If we pull together, we can make a strong statement about our resolve to look forward, not back

Let me be clear: I was firmly in the “remain” camp. I believed that while the EU is grotesquely flawed in many ways, the potential economic shock of leaving was simply not worth it. But now that the vote has gone the other way, there’s only one thing that matters: avoiding that potential shock, and if we can, engineering a lasting economic boost.

The key to that is confidence. Building confidence in Britain’s economic prospects outside the EU is the single most important thing we now need to do. For the next few weeks, the eyes of the world will be on us. People will be trying to understand why we voted the way we did, and wondering what it means for them. In particular, global investors will be weighing up their options: should they put planned investments on hold? Take their money out? Or perhaps even put more cash in?

The immediate reaction of many — including here in Britain — to the decision to leave the EU was to see it as us turning our backs on the world. However, if the international business community starts to hear that Britain will continue to be an open, dynamic, trading economy — and in fact we actually want to be more open and dynamic than before — then we can make that the reality.

Here’s how. Before I became an entrepreneur, I was a policy adviser to the prime minister, working across all areas of policy. Every year, I would draft a note from No 10 to the Treasury before the budget and autumn statement, outlining proposals to move the economy forward. It’s how I was able to push through policies to create the world’s most generous tax breaks for early-stage investment, as well as entrepreneur relief and other measures to help small businesses flourish.

Were I still working at Downing Street, here’s the submission I would make today, at this critical moment in our economic life. It’s a bold, positive agenda designed to boost confidence in Britain. Not so much a “punishment budget” as a “power-ahead budget”.

First, to boost global investor confidence, we should cut corporation tax to a worldwide low of 10%. At a stroke, this would make every global chief executive sit up and take notice. “Wow — shouldn’t we relocate to Britain?” they would ask. The answer is yes. Reducing our corporation tax rate to that level would instantly make the UK a top choice for business location, bringing jobs and investment in its wake.

Second, to boost small business confidence and resilience, we should take immediate action to cut business rates. Unlike corporation tax, which is paid only on profits, firms pay business rates whether they make money or not. They can be a massive factor in small companies such as high street shops having to shut when times are tough, and it’s a deeply regressive policy. We should make dramatic cuts to small business rates and compensate councils for the shortfall in revenue.

And finally, to boost public confidence, we should act quickly to deliver reform in one of the most high-profile areas of the referendum campaign: immigration. This would show citizens that their votes really do make a difference, going some way towards restoring faith in the political process. But it would also directly help our economic prospects if we made it easier for people who can make a contribution to our economy — for example, entrepreneurs or graduates from the world’s top 50 universities — to come and work here.

Part of this would be the new Australian-style points system we are promised, which ought to be outlined within the next 10 days. But we can also transform the efficiency of our immigration system, using modern technology such as data analytics and machine learning to make the process radically cheaper and faster. If we do that, there’s no reason why visa decisions couldn’t be made within 24 hours and at a fraction of the cost, so helping fast-growing British businesses recruit the talent they need to succeed globally.

These are all steps that the government could take quickly, and that would make our country an even better place to do business, as well as send an unmistakable signal to the world about the kind of country that the newly independent Britain wants to be.

If we pull together like this, we can make a strong and positive statement about our collective resolve to look forward, not back. And, most important of all, we can let the world know that Britain will never stop being entrepreneurial, never stop facing outwards and never stop inventing, making and trading.

So whichever way you voted in the referendum, it’s worth bearing in mind these beautiful words attributed to Johann Wolfgang Goethe: “Whatever you can do, or dream you can do, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic in it.” This is certainly a brave new world, but as long as we continue to dream and dare to be bold, Britain has the brightest possible future ahead.


lotus

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #266 on: June 26, 2016, 09:15:58 PM »
Thanks - if you don`t vote, don`t complain later ...

This seems to be fairly accurate... yes, 36% of 18-24 voted and only 58% of 25-34 year olds... let me know if the link doesn't work and I'll try again...

https://twitter.com/SkyData/status/746700869656256512
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Pumpkin

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #267 on: June 26, 2016, 09:19:37 PM »
So, here are a few things to consider late at night when you're contemplating the fall of the Roman Empire...

Corbyn now has essentially what he wanted – out of the EU. Cameron likewise. The irony is that Corbyn isn’t going to leave on his own accord. Therefore, he now becomes a central player in the negotiations to leave, should he actually feel like doing so. Labour needs to step up with whatever they've got left. 

Brexit terms and a relationship with the EU require the agreement of the remaining 27 members. There is little unity within the club; many of the newer entrants are very sceptical of the original Old Boys’ Club. Any bullying could trigger a referendum, and so it should.

Agreement requires a 'super qualified majority'; in other words, 72% of the remaining member countries which represent 65% of the remaining EU population. Further, the European Parliament must also approve any deal.

Before 2009, it wasn’t possible to leave. Permission to leave only comes with Article 50 which was enacted as a part of The Treaty of Lisbon – after Ireland was forced to re-do the referendum because they returned an ‘unfavourable decision’ the first time. Negotiations are envisaged to last for 2 years, but the article has never been invoked till now.

The notion that border controls must be asserted between Northern Ireland and the Republic is nonsense. Sweden and Norway have no such agreement, and the UK has always had special provisions in this regard since partition. Should the EU want to flex its muscle here, it risks alienating Ireland. There is a lot of talk in Dublin about preserving this unique relationship and a keen interest in not being forced to go heavy on Britain. Ireland is prepared to be an ally of Britain and this has been stated publically. In light of this, there is even a discussion about the merits of re-joining the 53-member state British Commonwealth. Ireland could easily play a key role in Brexit and it is in their interests to do so, given the economic inter-dependency between Ireland, Northern Ireland and the UK. Ireland has a lot at stake here and plenty to be pissed off at since the banking crises.

There are obvious reasons to conclude an intelligent and generous association deal, least of all because Euro-scepticism is at an all time high throughout the EU. Judging by their comments, both Merkel and Hollande realise this. There is no doubt that every pro-EU leader is on the edge, should a similar referendum be announced elsewhere – a very real possibility.

If the likes of Weber, Juncker and Schauble want to get nasty about this divorce, or should other countries want to use this as a test case for political opportunism (see Spain), they might want to consider whether or not it would create a domino effect.

Anyway, back to Twitter and Instagram and how we can overturn decisions....

gp(h)

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #268 on: June 27, 2016, 05:40:19 PM »
The size of the online petition may well lead to a debate in Parliament; however, it will need retrospective legislation which isn’t going to happen.

I have a simpler answer.

We should have another referendum to see if everyone is happy about the 1st referendum.

If the majority in the 2nd referendum are not happy then we can go back to the electorate with a “Do you want another EU Referendum Referendum.”

If the answer is yes, there will be a 2nd EU Referendum.

Obviously, the result of that might cause a bigger problem (hard to believe I hear you say).

If Remain win, are the votes of the 2 EU Referenda (?) added together to get a winner, or do we go to a 3rd EU Referendum as a best of 3?

If Leave win, then the little known Sturgeon Joker (Junker?) can be played ie. lose 2, win the 3rd and use Conkers Rules.



Master Ray

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Re: EU Referendum
« Reply #269 on: June 27, 2016, 07:36:32 PM »
Hasn't that petition been proved to be bogus?  I'll try and find the link...

The vast majority of votes seem to have come from abroad.  Fro memory, 39,000 votes came from Vatican City (which has 800 inhabitants) likewise 24,000 from North Korea...   :(
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