Author Topic: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors  (Read 18350 times)

Guillaume

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #225 on: October 21, 2019, 04:14:24 PM »
@Guillaume
The haunting of Julia sounds very good, i'm going to keep an eye out for that!

Absolutely love British horror films of the late 60's early 70's period

http://www.movieramblings.com/2018/06/25/from-the-vault-full-circle-1978/

Don't miss the Sony Movie Channel screening(s) because the last time they showed the film (in 2012/2013) the HD widescreen copy was very good, unlike the poor muddy copies you usually find on line of this film...it deserves to be seen widescreen, it's a visually and aurally gorgeous film...a slow burn gem, terribly moody and haunting!

And i haven't watched again SUSPIRIA yet cthulhu  ;), even if i own the blu ray now!...i will let you know if i change my mind about the film when i'll watch it in a few days/weeks.  ;)
 

Just in case you shouldn't know this classic, i recommend Fantastic Voyage from 1966.

I'm a big Richard Fleischer fan!!:

SOYLENT GREEN, THE BOSTON STRANGLER, 10 RILLINGTON PLACE, THE NEW CENTURIONS, MANDINGO, BLIND TERROR/SEE NO EVIL, THE VIKINGS, etc. He was a brillant, brillant director.
I remember mostly Raquel Welch in FANTASTIC VOYAGE ha ha, i have watched it a long time ago so i have to give it another viewing sooner or later...its "remake" INNERSPACE from the cool Joe Dante was big fun!
« Last Edit: October 21, 2019, 04:29:04 PM by Guillaume »

Whirlwind

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #226 on: October 21, 2019, 10:05:37 PM »


I'm a big Richard Fleischer fan!!:

What?!?

I guarantee you that if you start a Richard Fleischer Fan Club, you will be the only member.

He was awful. He was an assembly line director.  Just churn out a movie without any distinction. No art, no feeling...just a movie. I'm sure the studios liked him -- probably kept everything under budget and made movies that were safe and bland.

By the way, you mentioned some Fleischer movies, but failed to mention the only two good movies he did make:
TORA! TORA! TORA! and the Charles Bronson film MR. MAJESTYK.

cthulhu

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #227 on: October 22, 2019, 08:46:39 AM »
Quote
I remember mostly Raquel Welch in FANTASTIC VOYAGE ha ha, i have watched it a long time ago so i have to give it another viewing sooner or later...its "remake" INNERSPACE from the cool Joe Dante was big fun!

I think we wrote about it already some pages ago and i would say is totally worth a rewatch. Whereas you remember the beautiful girl i remember the beautiful fx;-) which have a timeless quality. It was a long search for me to get this one on blu as is with Innerspace. I don't find a version on blu and would love to see that one again. Joe Dante has done such great work: Piranhas, The Howling (needs a rewatch), Gremlins, Explorers, Matinee and the fantastic Small Soldiers.

@Whirlwind
I was glad that Shush and Ghosttrain showed up on this little island of special interest, it seemed that only very few people enjoy this genre and like to talk about thriller/horror and other obscure stuff, but with you i'm not sure. Because it is not quite clear what you're up to. So let's say you just find Fleischer to be a bad director, that's ok, and it is just your opinion
I haven't seen all the films Guillaume mentioned, but those i saw by Fleischer were very good movies: 20000 Leagues under the Sea, Fantastic Voyage, Soylent Green, Conan (well this one is a strange one;-)
 
So maybe you'd like to share with us which thriller/horror directors or movies you like, instead of just hitting another ones opinion.
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Guillaume

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #228 on: October 22, 2019, 09:10:34 AM »
movies that were safe and bland.

"The Boston strangler","10 Rillington place", "Mandingo", "Soylent green", "The new centurions"...safe and bland movies? really?  ::) :P

I think we wrote about it already some pages ago and i would say is totally worth a rewatch. Whereas you remember the beautiful girl i remember the beautiful fx;-) which have a timeless quality.

In fact i remember Miss Welch AND the fx AND especially the fact that the movie was very slow paced, static...but like i say i have to rewatch on BR  ;)

Joe Dante has done such great work: Piranhas, The Howling (needs a rewatch), Gremlins, Explorers, Matinee and the fantastic Small Soldiers.

I like Mr Joe very much too and i would like he direct more movies...one of his last ones "The hole" was pretty good (even more in 3D it seems) and his "Masters of horror" tv episodes "Homecoming" and "The Screwfly solution" were excellent too...he still "has it"!
"Gremins" is probably my favourite maybe in part because it was one of the very first movies i remember watching on the big screen, in theaters, back in Christmas 1984!  :) Timeless classic!
And there are some impressive creepy moments and atmosphere in "The howling", even if i like "An american werewolf in London" more  ;)   
« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 09:40:10 AM by Guillaume »

cthulhu

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #229 on: October 22, 2019, 11:22:51 AM »
Quote
And there are some impressive creepy moments and atmosphere in "The howling", even if i like "An american werewolf in London" more 
That brings me to a point, i love An American Werewolf in London and its safe to say that it is way better than The Howling.

But recently i saw Altered States again and was totally thrilled how good and outstanding it was. And then it came to my mind, that this one is a little older than two other masterpieces: An American Werewolf and Videodrome and i just had to think, that Altered States inspired both of those two. The effects in Altered States are hilarious and not only the Video effects, but also the prosthetic work is incredible! I always thought that Rick Baker was so inventive with American Werewolf and Videodrome, but i didn't know until then that he did all this before in Altered States.










Ken Russel is brilliant! Still searching for The Devils and Gothic on blu..


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Ghosttrain

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #230 on: October 22, 2019, 11:42:17 AM »
Don't know if it fits in this genre ? but my favourite ''dark'' ? film has to be ERASERHEAD.......anybody else here a fan of this or indeed anything else by the great (imho) Mr.David Lynch.?.... 8)...

cthulhu

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #231 on: October 22, 2019, 11:51:21 AM »
That one fits perfectly here! "In heaven, everything is f i n e..." ;-)
uhh, the first encounter with Eraserhead was a mood killer, it disturbed me quite a bit. I even have the Soundtrack on Vinyl.

And Lynch as a director also fits perfectly i would say. The new Twin Peaks episodes are mindblowing good! Just bought Wild at Heart on bluray and looking forward to have a good rewatch.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 11:54:01 AM by cthulhu »
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Guillaume

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #232 on: October 22, 2019, 01:05:11 PM »
But recently i saw Altered States again and was totally thrilled how good and outstanding it was. And then it came to my mind, that this one is a little older than two other masterpieces: An American Werewolf and Videodrome and i just had to think, that Altered States inspired both of those two. Ken Russel is brilliant! Still searching for The Devils and Gothic on blu..

Yeah "Altered states" is great!
The screenplay is very interesting and visually and aurally the film is a stunning experince!
Very influential movie you are probably right!...just look at the last bit/scene of the A-HA video clip "Take on me" and compare it with the ending of "Altered states"...  ;) :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djV11Xbc914

From Ken Russell i've only watched a few of his movies..."Altered states", "The devils" and "The music lovers" are very good, "Whore" is fun (i like the lead actress Theresa Russell who is a bit underrated) but "Gothic" and "Lair of the white worm" aren't so good.
I would like to watch "women in love", "Mahler", "Valentino" and "Crimes of passion".


 
That brings me to a point, i love An American Werewolf in London and its safe to say that it is way better than The Howling.

AAWIL is one of my favourite (horror) movies, it's a perfect mix of comedy, tragedy and horror...very well acted (David Naughton and Jenny Agutter are very good), with stunning even today special effects and great set-pieces (the opening, the subway/station scene, the weird dreams, the ending), it's kind of flawless and probably Landis's masterpiece. That's funny how the best (were)wolves movies were released in the same year: AAWIL, "the howling" and "Wolfen"!
AAWIL One of my favourite horror movies next to some of Argento and Carpenter's films, also "A nightmare on Elm street", "The Keep" and "Full Circle".   ;)
« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 01:40:46 PM by Guillaume »

Whirlwind

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #233 on: October 22, 2019, 01:57:45 PM »

So maybe you'd like to share with us which thriller/horror directors or movies you like, instead of just hitting another ones opinion.
.
The horror/thriller genre is not a particular fave of mine. If I had to pick a director that I find I enjoy more than a few movies in that genre it would be John Carpenter.

I don't really look for a particular director to enjoy a horror/thriller film. I enjoy particular films. THE EXORCIST, THE OMEN, RACE WITH THE DEVIL...those films were really creepy and fantastic. And, though I love the original Universal Studios monster films, I find the Hammer Christopher Lee/Peter Cushing films far more effective in the creeps department.

Modern horror seems to be gallons of blood. I don't go for that. But I did find THE GREEN INFERNO to be a real hoot. Dopey woke college kids in a gruesome situation of their own doing. I saw the humor the director was going for, and I liked the film. Supposedly the director is a legend in the modern horror film genre. That means nothing to me, I just enjoyed the film.




And I'll give a not considered a horror film choice as a fave of mine. The original PLANET OF THE APES. Sci-fi, yes, but if you watch the film through a horror prism, the film is pretty terrifying. A real nightmarish scenario. And what happens to Heston's two other astronaut partners...well, not many horror films can top that for disturbing terror.

Just look at this pictures below. You don't need Satanists and devils and monsters and gallons of blood to be terrifying. Heston in PLANET OF THE APES is in a terrifying nightmare:






« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 02:08:22 PM by Whirlwind »

Ghosttrain

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #234 on: October 22, 2019, 02:03:29 PM »
I also have ERASERHEAD sound track on vinyl,a very challenging listen to say the least..

cthulhu

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #235 on: October 23, 2019, 09:19:47 AM »
I also have ERASERHEAD sound track on vinyl,a very challenging listen to say the least..
Cool! And yes, i think i only listened to it two times;-) It is totally part of the Movie Experience and David Lynch also had a big part in it. Dunno if he wrote the music or...have to look again.

@Whirlwind
We already talked about the Green Inferno and since it is most likely to be a remake or new interpretation of the infamous Ruggero Deodato Movie i will have a look when i find that one for a cheap price. Eli Roth is more of a pseudo-legend in the modern genre, his Hostel is such a bad movie on amost every level, that i think he kind of ruined the genre with his violence for violence sake approach, that appealed to a younger generation, but has nothing to do with his often quoted influences from the Hooper, Carpenter, Craven, Romero area., who produced movies that had a substance and something to say.
I highly recommend: The American Nightmare to get an idea of what i mean.

"An examination into the nature of 1960s-'70s horror films, the artists involved, and how they reflected contemporary society."


Quote
You don't need Satanists and devils and monsters and gallons of blood to be terrifying.
Yes, that's true and you know that this thread is not about that and Planet of the Apes fits good in here.

So i couldn't wait and watched Full Circle yesterday on youtube. It was a viewing with mixed feelings, because of the quality on youtube. You could see immediately that this was shot very carefully and the lights and shots were superb!, but the quality reminded me of the VHS area, where you just had to see this special film and saw it on a fifth-generation copy with many, many technical errors in it, with VHS loosing much quality with every copy, mostly meaning the picture gets much darker and has fake colours and the sound also suffered from it.
In this case it was different, very blurred, some bucking but the sound was ok and you just could get the idea that this will look terriffic with a good restauration.
And yes, Guillaume was right, this one is a fantastic special one!

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Ghosttrain

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #236 on: October 23, 2019, 11:42:13 AM »
I was actually going to ask how many times you have listened to it........i played it once all the way through when i first got it,and about 50 seconds to a friend. ;D...According to Wiki,music by David Lynch,organ music by Fats Waller and ''In Heaven'' written by Peter Ivers.....I no longer have any means to play vinyl,and am certainly not in any hurry to buy the CD.. ::)... ;D...

Guillaume

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #237 on: October 23, 2019, 09:27:52 PM »
So i couldn't wait and watched Full Circle yesterday on youtube. It was a viewing with mixed feelings, because of the quality on youtube. You could see immediately that this was shot very carefully and the lights and shots were superb!, but the quality reminded me of the VHS area
And yes, Guillaume was right, this one is a fantastic special one!

Too bad your first viewing was a poor quality copy  :'(
There are some dark looking scenes (the basement scene with Keir Dullea, for example) so it needs to be seen on a decent looking print indeed. The visuals of the film are gorgeous, with the locations, the very nice use of Scope cinematography and the natural autumn/winter misty light of London...here are some striking scenes/shots in the film:

















At least, despite the poor Youtube link, what did you think of the soundtrack and Mia Farrow?
Your favourite scenes in the film?


Also about the story, the film's main mystery...SPOILERS


Do you think that the house was haunted or Kate's death led Julia to breakdown, schizophrenia and finally killing herself at the end, because she tragically couldn't cope with Kate's death...dying mostly the same way Kate died, the story finally coming "full circle"...  ;)

I must say the gorgeous, sweet, nostalgic piano soundtrack and some of the film's scenes have "haunted" me for years now...that ending/final shot around the chair is incredibly unsettling and heartbreaking...hard to forget.

Here's the famous Colin Towns's soundtrack on YT...i especially like the "Theme from Full Circle" and "Kate"...enjoy!!:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZDCmNOU9_E
« Last Edit: October 23, 2019, 10:19:57 PM by Guillaume »

cthulhu

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #238 on: October 24, 2019, 08:26:50 AM »
Quote
At least, despite the poor Youtube link, what did you think of the soundtrack and Mia Farrow?
Your favourite scenes in the film?

I'm going to write something about it, so for any who might want to see the movie sometime, there are some SPOILERS ahead:





The film really manages to create a mystery and the atmosphere of mystery. I absolutely loved the story which had some unexpected turns and there were these hints of conspiracy, or you felt that some of the protagonists were playing wrong and of course you wonder what is going on with Julia. It had more depth than a supernatural-haunted story and there were hints that this (the film) is a subjective pov of julia. So that Mirrors are important, maybe showing that she is reflecting herself.



But also the cursed storyline was very interesting and  really a bit scary how it unfolded and is also very important. Here we have kind of another twist showing reflection. A german boy was murdered, became a victim and the murderers were children, innocence became guilt. I don't know, maybe this is too much interpretation, but the revelations through the story were suspenseful and surprising and gave more layers.

There is this one scene, where Julia lies in bed on the right side of the frame in a dark room and on the left side the closed door shows a line of light underneath and Julia is sitting up and talking clearly and loudly into the dark: "don't be afraid!" and she is saying that TO someone. i think that shows that another person is talking right now - talking to julia, she is talking to herself, she is talking to the imagined ghost.
But is is not clear. The accidents that happen seem to be by chance, bad luck, a curse, or is Julia the curse?

There was only one thing that threw me out of the movie and made me wonder too much and it's at the very, very end so it didn't hurt that much;-) and maybe i'm too specific about it, but here is one change of tune in the song while the camera moves away from julia, where the theme keeps repeating and then it kind of "has" to change, it felt like they felt:" damn, we cant keep this on longer" and the tune goes up and thereby changes the mood slightly and it just threw me off. yeah, silly i know;-)

The score was very good, sometimes on the edge of too cheesy, because at first it just drags you with it, so emotional, but when you're into the mood of the film, it works very well.

This is really a beautiful, clever Movie from that time and i hope to see it again with a good restauration and transfer.
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Guillaume

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Re: Dario Argento and others thrillers/horror movies directors
« Reply #239 on: October 24, 2019, 10:19:13 AM »
Director Richard Loncraine about FULL CIRCLE after first screening in Cannes Market, May 1977:

"I wasn't so interested in the horror aspect of the story, what appealed to me was the chance to make a film in which there were two parallel stories, capable on entirely different interpretations. Curiously, nearly all the women who see the film think it is a ghost story, while men think it is the story of a breakdown." 



there are some SPOILERS ahead:

there were hints that this (the film) is a subjective pov of julia. So that Mirrors are important, maybe showing that she is reflecting herself.


SPOILERS!!!

Yes mostly a subjective POV of Julia...the mirrors, an  obvious visual symbol of split personality/schizophrenia...first time Julia sees herself in the mirror brought by Mark, she is scared of her own reflection/guilt, also think of the early scene in the bathroom when she washes the blood of her wounded leg, she sees her own reflection/guilt in the mirror, then she cries and says (to her dead daughter we presume) "My baby, forgive me" ...

then at the end, when she stares at her reflection in the bathroom mirror (just before Olivia the "ghost" child appears in the mirror) Julia isn't scared anymore of her own image...maybe she has accepted her guilt, or madness...her fate?
 
One of the fascinating things about the ending scene is that we don't really know what Julia thinks sitting in that chair...is she really aware of what's happening?
The director Richard Loncraine said about the ending that it had a double way of understanding it, it's up to the viewer:

either Olivia the "ghost" was Julia's delusion and Julia kills herself with her daughter's sharp toy, or Julia accepts to be killed by the evil child/her daughter look-alike (if you believe there is a ghost)...but in both cases like Loncraine said "Julia finds her child and her solace." 





there were these hints of conspiracy, or you felt that some of the protagonists were playing wrong

Yes at least in the first half, with Magnus's character and Lily's ambiguous feelings about Julia:
she seems to genuinely like Julia but she follows her brother's dodgy idea to set a seance in the house, to scare a bit more Julia and to have her money.



But also the cursed storyline was very interesting and  really a bit scary

Indeed!

First time i watched the movie i found many scenes/shots to be scary:

the scenes with Julia alone in her big house (the "Don't be frightened!" bit for example), Magnus's unwelcome intrusion in the house/the basement scene, the sharp toy in itself is a bit sinister, the "dream" (??) scene with the hands, the seance scene, the genius unexpected shot during the mental home scene of Olivia's eyes "piercing" through Julia's face (or is it a delusion of the half crazy old mother thinking her dead daughter came back from the grave?)...
and the stunning ending of course, i find this great picture (you could make a poster of it, really) of Olivia silently looking at Julia and then moving towards her still very creepy to this day!  Even the scene where Swift the alcoholic man is talking about his nasty childhood is kind of creepy, sinister...only because of the great lines and low key acting. 
"Low key" in fact seems the key word in that movie...the acting and the quite subtle way it creates fear and dread, mostly offscreen without jump scares and blood.



There is this one scene, where Julia lies in bed on the right side of the frame in a dark room and on the left side the closed door shows a line of light underneath and Julia is sitting up and talking clearly and loudly into the dark: "don't be afraid!" and she is saying that TO someone. i think that shows that another person is talking right now - talking to julia, she is talking to herself, she is talking to the imagined ghost.

But is is not clear. The accidents that happen seem to be by chance, bad luck, a curse, or is Julia the curse?

That's the idea. There are questions but at the end no answers. You understand what you want to take of the film's ambiguous mystery/story:

is Julia's house really haunted? or is she talking to herself, in fact, during this scene?

Director Loncraine said that in this particular scene he wanted to "reverse" some of the clichés of the haunted house stories:

here in this scene and in the whole story the lead character isn't especially afraid of the "haunting"...because of her loneliness, despair, she WELCOMES a child , she welcomes the "ghost"...even when she learns that the child is a nasty, killer little blonde girl...


There was only one thing that threw me out of the movie and made me wonder too much and it's at the very, very end so it didn't hurt that much;-) and maybe i'm too specific about it, but here is one change of tune in the song while the camera moves away from julia, where the theme keeps repeating and then it kind of "has" to change, it felt like they felt:" damn, we cant keep this on longer" and the tune goes up and thereby changes the mood slightly and it just threw me off. yeah, silly i know;-)

No it's not silly, i can see what you mean, the last track "changes" twice but i think it's precise editing, first to slowly reveal Julia's "change" (her death, when that great tracking shot around the chair reveal her deadly neck wounds) then when the end credits start:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CyumkItcZiY

I remember first time i watched the film in the mid 90's i thought that the film was going to end on the lovely, sweet cute shot of Julia accepting the "angelic" Olivia in her arms, that the film was going to end on the camera doing a half circle around the chair, "Stay with me...stay" and then fade to black, end credits...it would have been a beautiful poetic ending, already. 
BUT it ended with the lights going out, the camera endlessly moving around the chair and slowly revealing the character's lonely, tragic fate (in my opinion the whole story is about her slow suicide because of overwhelming guilt and loss)...i was like OH MY GOD!! jaw dropping moment!...incredibly unsettling, moving but somewhat beautiful/darkly poetic.


The score was very good, sometimes on the edge of too cheesy, because at first it just drags you with it, so emotional, but when you're into the mood of the film, it works very well.

"Emotional" is the word! It sounds mavbe a bit "dated" now especially the 70's keyboards sound but that soundtrack is something...it really nails the sad, bleak, erratic wandering moods of Julia's character and the story...very pretty melodies and a big part of the film's atmosphere with the visuals and Mia Farrow's "ghost-like" performance. Loncraine said that he and Mia Farrow mostly agreed to make the movie when they listened to a demo track Colin Towns recorded in pre production before the shooting, Loncraine said "i could see a movie in that track".
Some of my favourite scenes/shots enhanced by the soundtrack are the opening credits scene, Julia's encounter with her new house, pictures of Kate all around the floor,  the walk in the park, the car drive at night under the rain and the whole ending.


There is this one scene, where Julia lies in bed on the right side of the frame in a dark room and on the left side the closed door shows a line of light underneath

The frame compositions, the use of widescreen cinematography is really beautiful in that movie...all the scenes in the house for example, Loncraine said that he used Panavision, Cinemascope to make the house (and in that scene the room) like a character...Julia on the right side of frame, the closed door on the left side, the space is used skillfully in many compositions. A claustrophobic feel at times (lots of close up of Julia's face, showing us her feelings, without dialogues/lines).
« Last Edit: October 24, 2019, 09:37:38 PM by Guillaume »